Episode 107

Meet Emily & Kathleen

January 17, 2017

At over 100 episodes in and with so many new listeners, we thought we’d take a moment to reintroduce ourselves, share what we stand for and what makes us tick as creative entrepreneurs, and of course reveal some random, silly, and maybe never-before-shared facts about ourselves.

This Episode Brought to You By:
"There's a difference between confidence and self-esteem."
- Kathleen Shannon

Discussed in this Episode

  • How we cultivate confidence
  • Our daily habits and routines
  • When boundaries get challenged
  • How we build our creative community and creative friendships
  • Our money mindsets & how we make money
  • Quickfire round!

featured download!

In this episode, the Your Ideal Day worksheet was mentioned. Download your copy here!


More from Kathleen

Braid Creative

More from Emily

Almanac Supply Co.


Unknown Speaker 0:01
Hello, and welcome to being boss,

Emily Thompson 0:03
a podcast for creative entrepreneurs. I'm Emily Thompson.

Kathleen Shannon 0:07
And I'm Kathleen Shannon.

Hey guys. So for today's episode, Emily and I realize that we're at over 100 episodes in this is episode number 107. And some of you have been with us since the very beginning or some of you might be new to being boss. So we thought that we'd take a moment to kind of interview each other, and let you guys get to know us a little bit better about who we are, and what we're up to, and kind of maybe get a little bit more personal and behind the scenes with this one,

Emily Thompson 0:47
I can't wait.

Kathleen Shannon 0:48
And as always, you can find everything that we mentioned the tools, books and links we reference on the show notes at WWW dot being boss club. Hey guys, I want to take a second and talk a little bit about getting on track with your finances and your business. So there are a few ways you can stay organized, but I'm going to propose fresh books cloud accounting, is the best way to send out invoices so that you can get paid faster. You can track your income and expenses and quickly pull reports to see exactly where you're at with your finances and your business. You can organize and keep track of your clients. You can even track your time right in freshbooks so try it for free today. Go to freshbooks comm slash being boss and enter being boss in the How did you hear about this section? You know, it's time to give it a try.

All right, so we've got some pillars of what it means to be boss and I thought it'd be cool to just go through each one and talk about how we use these in our personal and professional lives. So starting with mindset, I'm really super curious, Emily,

Unknown Speaker 2:12

Kathleen Shannon 2:14
do you cultivate confidence? Like how do you really build up confidence and I kind of in general, think of you as a really confident person? Do you ever get struck with insecurities? Are you ever freaked out or scared?

Emily Thompson 2:27
Sometimes I cry into my pillow that happens occasionally not very often. But it does happen. I am a pretty confident person I I grew up with parents who instilled in me a very strong sense of confidence that I could do whatever I wanted and be whoever I wanted to be and and as ridiculous as this sounds, I was like a childhood beauty queen like I did pageants as a kid.

Unknown Speaker 2:57
Why did I know this? I think I knew

Unknown Speaker 3:02
you were a pageant kid. I

Emily Thompson 3:03
was a pageant kid.

Kathleen Shannon 3:05
And I'm loving this episode.

Emily Thompson 3:08
That was the thing it was nothing like what is it Toddlers and Tiaras or whatever that crazy. It was nothing like that. Whenever I was a kid, it was a little more wholesome. I like to believe at least they're like my childhood lenses. And And apparently, I guess I was pretty good at it. People loved me. And that instilled a ton of confidence in me, I absolutely know that that is what gave me some level of poise at least for a poor little Alabama girl. And quite a bit of confidence. So I think that my parents putting me through that as a kid and letting me try things like I you know, I did volleyball for a while and softball, and I did. I was a majorette for a minute I did flag in high school and I was in the band like I did all the things because my mom really encouraged me to try as much as I wanted to try. So for me even now when I'm ever having like one of those crying the pillow moments, one of the things that always pulls me out of that is thinking about the proof that I have, in terms of I know what I'm capable of, and I know what I can accomplish whenever I pick myself up and do the thing. So on the daily I am pretty confident person and that's just come from many years of of doing things and failing over and over but also always picking myself up and reaching my goals or making it do in whatever way, whatever way I'm trying. So for me now, continuing with the confidence that I have is around looking back and seeing the proof that I have that I can do hard shit. And I feel like that's how I keep it in moments of doubt. Right? What about you You are also badass. Post apocalypse. Kathleen your bitch boots and your crazy ass hair every couple of months. When do you ever feel like not owning it?

Kathleen Shannon 5:09
Oh my gosh, well, you know what I should mention a little bit of my background, which is I grew up in the medieval fair, like juggling as a little Jester in the court. Right. So

Emily Thompson 5:25
I was the princess.

Kathleen Shannon 5:28
And I was the freak show on the medieval fair, and I did it for a long time. So I learned how to juggle whenever I was eight. And that gave me a lot of confidence. But then, I always felt a little bit like an outsider in middle school in high school, I was always voted most nonconformists. And so I had this idea that popularity might give me confidence. And as our show itself grows, and we grow as experts in our career, I thought that getting the validation of likes, and fan letters, and all the amazing things I love engaging with with our audience on would make me feel confident. But I have learned that popularity does not make me feel confident. If anything, it has shaken my confidence more than ever. And I know that sounds like real like, oh, boohoo sorry about you. But it's true. Like if anything, success itself has shaken my confidence. And I know that it has for a lot of the bosses listening because we've heard them say it like they're scared of success as much as they are a failure. And I've experienced that. I also think that another thing that has really shaken my confidence over the past couple of years, is having a kid and like I mean, nothing will make you feel like you don't know what you're doing, than being at the mercy of a toddler. But you know, it coming back around to then my experience of kind of being most nonconformist, or learning how to juggle in a righteous age, I'm realizing that there's a difference between confidence and self esteem. And what I really want to cultivate is self esteem. And this is gonna sound really weird, but I dropped something down my sink the other day, and I had to take my sink apart by myself, Jeremy was outside doing some things in lawn work. And I took my sink apart by myself got the thing out of the drain, it was a bottle of essential oil. And

Emily Thompson 7:30
thank you for clarifying, because it could have been anything. I mean,

Kathleen Shannon 7:32
it could have been anything, it was a bottle of peppermint essential oil, I dropped it down the sink, I took the sink apart, I put it back together and I felt like such a badass, like, forget closing on a book deal. Forget buying homes, forget launching a six figure business like I need to take apart a sink and put it back together to feel confident and to build some self esteem.

Emily Thompson 7:57
Right? I love that like, and bringing it to that really practical level of like doing shit doing hard things that you've never done before. I think that's hugely powerful. Like, whenever, whenever I was a kid again, like, my mom was the one who would like lay the hardwood floor,

Kathleen Shannon 8:13
or my mom to would like tile the floor. I remember we all did this together as a family. It was a little janky

Emily Thompson 8:21
right? I mean, that kind of goes without saying. But um, but I think there's so much to be said about doing things like that. I feel like are now I don't know, maybe our culture does or doesn't depending on where you are, really makes a lot of the hard tasks either just handing them off delegating them to someone else, and we preach it all the time, like delegate that shit for sure. But sometimes whenever I need a boost of confidence, I'm gonna go like, I don't know assemble a bookcase, or something that comes with clear instructions for sure. I'm not gonna figure it out from the ground up. But but really sort of solving some sort of puzzle and doing something with my hands, I think does bring me back to to a level of mindfulness and accomplishment that helps fuel confidence, maybe even when I'm not really feeling it that much. So I love that a ton. Along with confidence, I think that I think that one of the things that I like to bring into the boss mindset, as much as possible is super mindfulness. And I, I almost feel like that mindfulness or even self awareness really lends itself hugely to, to confidence and self esteem. I think it's a lot easier to cultivate your own self esteem when you are being self aware. Whereas if you're never like getting in touch with who it is that you are or what it is that you're feeling, it's really hard to think that what you're doing or what you're feeling is worth anything. So I feel like that's something that requires This podcast for over two years now has really forced me to do is become really self aware. Like, I don't want to be the crackpot who's just talking shit not living it. So as we are talking about, you know, being a boss and having the right mindset, what does that mean? And for me, it's self awareness and allowing that self awareness to bring confidence into my life and owning it. Because I think that's another piece too, like you can be self aware and have reasons to feel confident. But if you don't own it, and choose to feel confident, you won't.

Kathleen Shannon 10:35
Amen. All right, let's get into habits and routines. I would love to hear kind of like a personal professional mix of the day in the life of what it's like to be Emily Thompson.

Emily Thompson 10:52
It's not very exciting. It's funny, I'm recording this and I'm literally wearing the shirt that I slept in last night. I was just joking that I'm not wearing a bra. But it was like, Yo,

Kathleen Shannon 11:05
I love how this turned into what are you wearing?

Emily Thompson 11:07
Right. So let me tell you about how glamorous my day is, is really what this is going at. Um, so I usually wake up about 630 or seven. And I spend the first hour of my day usually in bed because my floors are really creepy in my house. And I don't want to wake Lily yet because that means like life has to start. So I usually lay in bed and read the news, or place in two dots on my phone, or maybe I'll get my journal out in journal or if I'm really feeling productive, I'll get the laptop in bed and do some things but it just sort of spend the first hour hour and a half of my day just doing whatever the hell I want to from the bed or sometimes I'll sneak off to the living room and hang out on the couch, quietly alone, because as an introvert, that is super important for me. At about 8am Lily comes out of her room, and we start our day we make David good. Just

Unknown Speaker 12:02
to clarify Lily is your eight year old daughter.

Emily Thompson 12:05
Yes, she's my eight year old daughter.

Kathleen Shannon 12:07
And she's have one child.

Emily Thompson 12:09
Yeah, I only have the one. Only one child aged child there is still David who is my partner but he is getting out of bed at eight to because Lily is coming into the room and telling him to get out of bed. So we all get up and usually do breakfast. Lily is homeschooled. So at that point, we usually tell her to go get her journal or handwriting notebook and just do something while we're prepping breakfast. We make her get ready when she does the trash or whatever. So I usually spend the morning with my family, I drink a hot cup of tea. And between nine and 10 I'll usually scoot to the studio and and start work, usually go through my email, get some tasks checked off the list, have a couple of meetings throughout the day. David, if I'm in meetings all day, sometimes David will bring me lunch at my desk that happens sometimes. Or I'll go out and have lunch with David and Lily. And then usually about five o'clock, I'm really good. About five o'clock, my day is over. And I will leave the studio I'll shut everything down, leave the studio and go cook dinner or we'll go out to dinner or whatever. We just sort of spend the evening sometimes we'll watch TV, we don't really have a set routine for after work, just whatever comes up. And then I'm usually in bed by like 830 or nine and asleep by 10. I'll lay in bed and read for a while. So that is the glamorous day in the life of Emily Thompson. What about you, you have a toddler? So yours is probably a little different?

Kathleen Shannon 13:44
Yeah, so I think that as of this episode, releasing, my toddler will have just turned three. Yay. Yeah. So his name is Fox. And I'll start with the morning. He sleeps with us currently. So

Emily Thompson 14:00
glaring, right, you can do whatever you want. Honey is your bed.

Kathleen Shannon 14:05
It is what works for us right now. So he sleeps with us, which I actually love, especially during the colder months. We're just little cuddle bugs with each other. It's it's actually really sweet. I love it. So I'll usually wake up around. Well, he'll usually wake up with Jeremy around 630 and I'll hear them go downstairs together and Jeremy will make him some french toast and get the coffee going. And I'll usually sleep in for another 30 minutes. And whenever I wake up at seven, I come downstairs. My favorite part of my day is coming downstairs and Fox squealing whenever he sees me as if we weren't just sleeping together and cuddling all night. So that's really sweet. And I'll usually grab a cup of coffee and cuddle on the couch with him for about 10 minutes and then I'll get up and actually start working. So at this point, I'm going through my emails I'm looking at my tasks. To dues for the day, I might write something like if there's something really urgent, like we have a bunch of sales emails to go out, or if we have an agenda for a podcast, like I'm usually looking at my Asana and just seeing what tasks need to be done if and if there are any that I can just knock out really quick in the morning. And after that, I will usually get ready Jeremy's heading out to work, I'll get myself ready, I will get Fox ready for preschool or for his nanny, his nanny will usually come pick him up. And at that point, I go to the gym. And so every morning I lift really heavy weights, my hands are like man hands with calluses on them. And I love actually going to this gym because I can listen to podcasts on the way which I love doing. And if I'm not going to the gym, I'm usually going on a really long walk. And after that I'll do some kettlebell swings or something like that. But every morning that is like my non negotiable self care thing that I do for myself, it totally keeps me sane. Um, and then after I work out, I'll get home I'll make myself something to eat. And which is super important. I'll usually take a shower and get ready. And really this has taken up a big chunk of my morning at this time. And then after that, I will dive into work. So usually that includes some meetings that includes a lot of writing, especially as we're writing this book. And that's pretty much it around for 430 Fox will either come home or I'll go pick them up. And then it's just evening hustle, which is dinner, I'm usually the one that cooks. Jeremy's usually the one that does the dishes and the laundry, we're going through all of our daily chores of just taking care of a household and a toddler. It's bath time, Fox still can't fall asleep by himself. So I'm usually laying in bed with him and helping him fall asleep. And that's whenever I get on my Kindle and read my books. So after that, I might watch a little bit of Netflix and chill with my man. drink a cup of tea and go to bed.

Emily Thompson 17:09
That sounds dreamy.

Kathleen Shannon 17:11
It really is pretty dreamy.

Emily Thompson 17:14
Right? I love that I was I've tasked myself with re looking at my ideal day for the new year. And as we're shifting some roles and being boss, and how it is that we're going to be spending our days. And I catch myself quite often like going into my ideal day. And it not looking really all that different from what my life currently looks like. Like I love that I don't have to commute most days, because I will say I kind of wish that like I had an end of day commute like a time where I could decompress between you know, the 12 feet, it takes me to go from my desk to the kitchen, or whatever, that would be handy. But I love that I don't have to commute and that I can stop and have long lunches with my family. Or that I can work in my PJs and my yoga pants or, or whatever it may be that like I like my daily routine pretty well. There are some things I should could maybe have an idea

Unknown Speaker 18:16
for you.

Emily Thompson 18:16
Yes. Oh, I

Kathleen Shannon 18:18
forgot to mention that I usually do my makeup and get dressed. Like three out of five days I do that.

Emily Thompson 18:24
I do it probably two out of five days,

Kathleen Shannon 18:26
I think mostly because I really like doing my makeup like that's my hobby.

Emily Thompson 18:31
It is and you're

Kathleen Shannon 18:32
my creative outlet. But oh my idea for you was whenever it comes to decompressing at the end of the day, I know that your word for this year, I'm pretty sure his strength. And that you're I mean, I know that that's a lot of different things. But I talked about wanting to do more yoga. Like what if you had integrated like a yoga routine at the end of your day as I mean, I definitely think getting out of your house and into a yoga studio might be the best way to find that separation. But what if something like that? Or do you prefer to do yoga in the morning?

Emily Thompson 19:05
I think I do prefer doing yoga in the evening. And I'm giggling over here because the last time I did go to yoga in the evening, because quite often I'll do it in the morning. Last time I do in the evening, I pulled in and the car next to me like hit my car like with her door. And I was like livid like someone had just honked at me like in the parking deck and I was just one of those days where I was really done. And I go into yoga and she's sitting next to me after right one of those though it just makes me giggle to think of going to yoga and evening after I'm already like super wound up by um but yes, so part of my plan is certainly getting yoga and more regularly. And even I love doing yoga at home like that is totally one of my favorite things. And I've thought about one it would be cool to do it in the studio just because I've really good space to do it. But I also know that I need to get out of the studio and able in order to do that.

Kathleen Shannon 19:57
So you mean like your home studio

Emily Thompson 20:00
Yes, my home studio. But I do like doing yoga here. And I do need to do some more integration of getting that in more regularly because I do go to yoga classes relatively often, I will just sort of pop a downward dog in the bedroom on occasion. But I could definitely make it more of a part of my daily routine.

Kathleen Shannon 20:22
Oh, I wanted to mention my iPhone games, because you mentioned too, that I've been obsessed with color cube lately.

Emily Thompson 20:31

Kathleen Shannon 20:32
it's like different shapes that you have to shift around to create a pattern. And then also blend Doku Have you played that one, putting colors in the order of their gradient. I mean, these are like graphic designer nerd names

Unknown Speaker 20:48
over here.

Emily Thompson 20:51
I love it I am. So I would love to talk about that for a second. Because I think it's in part of habits and routines. And especially when we get to boundaries in a second, I have one game on my phone. Only one and it's the kind of game where I get five tries. And then I'm done for like an hour and a half, like I can't try anymore. And and it's the kind of game that once you reach some certain level, you have to wait until the next upgrade to get the rest of them. And so I'm very like, boxed in as to how much time I can spend on this game. And, and for me that has been very important and like, part of keeping my daily routine super productive is is keeping it to the one game and also just removing Facebook from my phone, which can be scary for some.

Kathleen Shannon 21:37
I do too much Facebook Live thing to delete it from my phone on the go. I recently deleted it from my phone, and then I had to reinstall it

Unknown Speaker 21:45

Kathleen Shannon 21:46
because which we do from the being boss Facebook page, not the being boss Facebook group. But on the Facebook page. I'm usually popping in on Tuesdays at one central if you guys ever want to hang out with me there. But um, yeah, I definitely just have the two games. I do play Words with Friends with my parents, like I'm not gonna play Words with Friends with strangers, but I kind of think of it as how I bond with my parents.

Emily Thompson 22:10
I love that that's acceptable.

Kathleen Shannon 22:14
Alright, so we kind of started to get into boundaries a little bit, as far as that delineation between your work day and then your life because you do work from home. But I'm curious, when do you feel like your boundaries as a creative entrepreneur are most challenged.

Emily Thompson 22:35
I think my boundaries are most challenged whenever I'm really excited about something that I'm working on. Like whenever I have a new project, or I'm like knee deep in or neck deep and something that I really want to be doing. But I have these boundaries around, you know, making sure I spend breakfast with my family or dinner with my family or you know, not working at night or especially on the weekends. But whenever I'm really excited about something that I'm creating that shit is hard, really hard. So definitely when I'm created, or whenever I'm excited about what I'm creating, that's when it's hardest. Otherwise, I have no problem turning it off at five, or waiting until nine or 10 to get started. Definitely don't have a problem not working on the weekends. Like that's okay with me. But whenever I'm excited about something, it's really hard to keep me away from work. For sure.

Kathleen Shannon 23:27
You know, on that note, for me, I think that I've created such structure and routine around my ideal day. Oh, and I wanted to mention this, we have an ideal day worksheet. If you guys haven't downloaded it yet, it's on our website at www dot being boss club. I think it's in the sidebar over there so you'll be able to find it. But um, for me, I think that I have created enough structure and routine around my ideal day that the boundaries are naturally fit into that. But whenever I'm neck deep into something that I'm excited about, like a book, for example, I'm cool with thinking that maybe for three months, I'm going to be writing on a Sunday while Fox and Jeremy go down to the in laws house. And me just staying home and working on that. That doesn't really bother me anymore. And I think that's the way that I've evolved as a boss is that I used to be so strict on myself at wanting to be the best boss by making my weekends, the weekends and never working past five. But now I'm at the point where if I need to break my own boundaries, I'm cool with that no big deal.

Emily Thompson 24:30
I agree for special projects. I'm the same way this past summer whenever I was creating rock your web design business. I like I sat down with my family or David specifically and I was like look for the next six weeks I'm going to be busting like 50 hours a week, which is not a normal thing by any means. But for me to get this thing created, it was really important. And I was like so in order for me to do that one like you're gonna have to make meals which ended very soon because David's ideal idea of healthy eating is very different from owning

Kathleen Shannon 25:00
pizza rolls for

Emily Thompson 25:02
lots of corn dogs and things like that. And I was like, you're gonna have to do some cooking, I'm gonna be working on the weekends, I'm gonna be working on the evenings. And he was totally game and I did it. And then once the project was done, I went back to my regular routine. But apart from special projects, sometimes I just get really excited about things. And I do have those boundaries in place to keep me from, from overdoing it and not just overdoing it and stepping over boundaries I have with my family, but also with myself like it's, it's not as healthy for me to sit here at my computer for that many hours a week on going. So I think these boundaries are in place to keep us good on the regular. But I also love the ability to shamelessly break them when and if I want to. I want to talk about your boundaries, and especially around the things that you say no to. Because I know that's something that comes up a lot. And we're about to go. And I guess we are in a season of intentionally saying no to most things that come up. So I'd love to hear about how it is that you decide what to say yes. And what to say no to.

Kathleen Shannon 26:18
Yeah, so for me, right now, I'm just automatically saying no to everything unless it is a really compelling reason to say yes. So I mean, even like really great trips that I've wanted to go on with friends, I'm having to say no, because we are having to hunker down and do some pretty intense work right now. But also I need to like hunker down with my family, I've did a lot of travel, apart from my family in 2016. And I know that everyone thinks about, like taking time off like the first year to be with a baby. But what I'm starting to realize, as Fox gets older, that's when I really want to start spending more time with him because he's more impressionable. And so I can't really be traveling as much like every month as I was before. So for me, it's just really taking a look at what my big picture goals are. Actually, that's my intention for this month is looking at the big picture. Because I've been so stuck in the minutiae of the daily grind, and really even just month to month that I'm not really thinking about the kinds of traditions and even just the kind of person that I want to be in 510 or 15 years, I am very present with where I'm at in my business, almost to a fault. So I'm starting to really think about the big picture and how these opportunities or events that I'm being offered fit into that big picture of who I want to be. And it just takes a lot of you know what you're talking about earlier mindfulness. And so that basically right now, I've just had to kind of get into the auto pilot No, in order to, in order to maintain my boundaries. And I do have like the, I'm really challenged with boundaries around wanting to give all I've got to every single email I get, or every single Instagram tag I get like, I want to be able to engage with our community, because I love you guys. But if at some point, I don't say no, or cut it off somewhere, I'm just going to become spread thin, and that's not going to be good for anybody.

Emily Thompson 28:32
I agree. I love what you said once about, about you had made yourself possibly even more available to our community than you were your own kid. And I think that that like that bit of self awareness is super important. And it's equally as important to like, make the adjustments to fix it. And I also like what you said about looking at the intention that you have, and using that to shape the actions that you take around whatever it may be. And in this case, it's what you say yes, and say no to. That's something that I took into account in 2016. My word of the year was joy. And so I made this very intentional intention of of only saying yes to things that I really want to do that I knew would bring me joy, and giving myself that that boundary in terms of you know, does it bring me joy or not made it easy for me to say no to opportunities that came up or even you know, to emails that roll down like I do have an assistant and it is her job to take care of emails that I don't need to be paying personal attention to. So I think that I think that's really important is knowing what you want knowing what it is that you want to cultivate in your life and using that as the boundary to shape the actions that you take. Genius.

Kathleen Shannon 29:54
Yes, very All right. Let's talk about About our creative wolf pack and our tribe of friends and kind of the way that we network, and which is all like very relationship based. So I'm really curious, have there been any relationships that have especially impacted your career?

Emily Thompson 30:21
One was a miss Kathleen Shannon, for way less like that, I feel like the most obvious one. But yeah, there are a couple of them, I make it, I make it a point to at least once a month, if not two or three times about to have Skype calls with people that I have met in the past. And a couple of them are repetitive that we have, you know, sort of standing ongoing meetings or at least you know, trying to get together every couple months or so. And, and those relationships are sometimes they're not like the most profitable, like your relationship has been very profitable, Kathleen, I appreciate it.

Unknown Speaker 30:59
You're welcome.

Emily Thompson 31:01
Right with some of them are just are just really nurturing and other ways. And I think that are the people they include or people that I've met at conferences or people that I I hooked up with on Instagram or, or things like that, or just sent me a nice email once that really sort of hit home. I think that I know that I have several relationships that have been really impactful. Some of them have been people that I've ended up working with, like, like our lawyer autumn Boyd, who, who is actually a friend of mine, we go have lunch together at least once a month, I think. I think that relationships can be very fruitful on a very business level. And or a very personal level, My favorites are those that are both. But But yes, relationships have been huge for my business. I always think about there's like an eminent buttress saying here, but there's like this saying about you know, is it's all about who you know, and I think there's like another part of it that leads up to that, but I completely agree with that. And I don't want to be like one of those weird networkers like I know some of those people, they're people who just like need to meet everyone, because they see that as currency. And I don't see it as currency. I don't want to be weird and achy about it. But I do like making connections. And whenever I do make them, I like them to be very nurturing for both of us. Because you never know what's going to happen. And that's something that I feel I have grown into a lot over the past couple of years, especially, is you never know where a connection is going to go. Like if I had only imagined, you know, six years ago, or whatever, that a couple of blog comments between you and I would turn into a multimedia conglomerate. Or like what being bosses becoming, I would have probably shut myself then in there. But I didn't know when told me that. So pants are safe. I am very pleased, though, obviously, where this relationship has, has taken us. So absolutely. I have multiple relationships with people who have completely and utterly shaped my business and even me personally. And I think that making connections like that are certainly pivotal in building a successful business, but also building a successful entrepreneur, like and being as or building a successful and healthy entrepreneur is making those connections and having people to tap for different perspectives or, or to aid you and whatever it is that you need help with, or whatever. I think relationships are super important. Yeah,

Kathleen Shannon 33:37
totally. Right. And I feel like I haven't had as much time to cultivate or nurture some of the relationships that I've had, as we've gotten more focused into building our business and creating boundaries. And also having a toddler, I just, I don't know if any of you other parents who have young children can relate. But I feel out of the loop. Like there are times where I don't even know what new restaurants have opened. But I do one of the things I do love about living where I live as much as I've talked about moving, and I still do, but I do one of the things I love the most is being able to go anywhere, and finding another creative entrepreneur who's making a go in a state where we've just all kind of huddled up together and created a really tight knit community. And that's my favorite thing. And like you said, I think it's cool not knowing where relationships are going to take you and not really going into every single friendship or networking event or opportunity thinking how can someone make me better? or How can I turn this into a partnership or a collaboration? I definitely like going into things thinking conversation first. becoming friends second, like so I just really want to have good conversations as all and get super curious and know someone's story. Maybe become Friends, maybe not maybe become great acquaintances like grab coffee every once in a while, you know, like, I definitely felt like earlier in my career, I had to be best friends with every single one of my clients. And I had to really like, say yes to every coffee date. And I think that's where I'm kind of like, getting some boundaries now. But I also love about cultivating my Wolfpack and my creative tribe, like I think a lot about just our community that we've created with being boss and going on our trips to New Orleans, and Miami. I mean, those have been some of the best moments of my life truly. And the relationships that have come out of those have been so incredible. So I don't know, just even on a personal note, that's one of my favorite things to do in our work together is cultivate these relationships with people by going on vacation with them.

Emily Thompson 36:03
I agree. And I feel like some of those, I mean, they're like genuine connections like these are people that like I'm Instagram messaging, like funny things, because we talked about that one thing once like, these are definitely relationships that that bloom into beautiful things. Something else I want to touch on a little bit with this and almost like the exact opposite of your creative Wolfpack is I still love super nurturing relationships that have that with people who don't give a shit what I do, or are not, they don't give a shit at what I do. But they're not as aware of who I am professionally, which as as being post grows and grows. And so many of my friends and connections and the people that I run into on the daily are really aware of what it is that I'm creating, I have learned to really appreciate the relationships with people that I have that, that don't connect with me because I'm a podcaster. And I talk about creative business things. I have a couple of friends and some of them are even some of my oldest friends, where you know, we've made a pact where they're not going to listen to the podcasts. Really Yeah. Because just because there are people with which I don't want to talk about business and I feel like so many creatives are so many entrepreneurs will find that very uncomfortable in the beginning, like this idea that people don't understand what they do. Or you know, they don't have anyone to talk business with. And and I know that's a struggle. But I also challenge people to almost keep those relationships intact as they are. Because as you do grow, and as all of your conversations turned into turn into business conversations, you'll find great solace in the relationships that don't ever go there. That's something that I have found a whole lot of comfort in over the past year especially is having people with which that I can just shoot the shit and not ever talk about business models with.

Kathleen Shannon 38:03
I love this so much. My best friend is actually my employee over at braid creative. She's our creative director, and I still go on vacation with her once a year. She doesn't listen to the podcast, and I never even really thought about the fact that she doesn't listen to the podcast. And I'm not saying for you listeners out there. Stop listening if you want to be our friend, that's not the case at all, because I certainly have some really great friends who don't miss an episode Jeremy, my own husband has listened to every single episode. Admittedly, he listens to them at 1.25 speed, I think. So now whenever he listens to us at normal speed, he thinks that we sound sad. But um, this is why I love my workout buddies. These are guys that I'm lifting heavy weights with every single day I spend more time with them than I do with some of my friends or family. And so they've become really close and they're aware of the podcast, but not in the same way that like a creative entrepreneur might be aware of it. Like they're all just doing jujitsu and lifting heavy weights. And I kind of think it's I don't know fun to have a little bit of separation there. And I have found the personal professional blend to be more challenging than ever whenever it comes to not talking about work with my friends because I love it like sometimes I can't help it. I mean, Emily, even you and I, whenever we go on vacation together, we're talking about work before we even turn the lights on before we've even brushed our teeth we're

Emily Thompson 39:36
talking about is a true story. Well, and then like even me like David is my business partner like as well as my life partners. So sometimes like legit pillow talk and we took we have some boundaries around that as well. But it is very fantastic. And I'm like I'm a decade into entrepreneurship. I'm a decade plus into entrepreneurship. And I remember having days in the beginning where I just Wish that people understood what I did. And as you do this thing and cultivate your creative tribe, you will have people who understand what you do, and that hole gets filled, and you become so much, you become so much more appreciative of the relationships that you had before, that may have been a struggle whenever you wanted them to understand, but now you can accept and enjoy that they don't.

Unknown Speaker 40:23
Alright, let's talk about money. Do you really stress out about it?

Emily Thompson 40:28
sometimes not so much anymore. And that's just thank God has come from a decade plus of entrepreneurship, and finally finding models that work. So I don't have to stress about it very much. But even part of that is because David does all of our money management, David does stress about it, sometimes. Sometimes we have conversations about it. Where like, actually today, for example, for the first quarter of, of 2017 of this year, all of our income is coming from being boss, which has never happened before. I'm not doing anything in the shop, agafay we're delivering rock your web design business, but we're not launching anything, we don't have any clients. So this will be the first time maybe ever since starting being boss that we will be relying solely on being boss for like our personal income. And that has David stressing the fuck out. And not because the money's not there, it's just the idea of putting all your eggs in a single basket, which is not something we've had to do in a long time. So he's stressing out about it, because it's his job too. And I'm like, shit, it's fine. Like, it'll all be great. Second quarter, we'll come we'll relaunch rock, your web design business and things will be amazing. So even as we've become very comfortable in our revenue streams, and we have, we have no income coming in consistently, it is still something as a brand or as a business is stressed about. But because I have personally taken that stress and those responsibilities and delegated them to someone else, I'm usually okay. I also trust the process a lot more than bean counter. David does. I have I counted my own beans for a very long time. And I knew that if things ever got low or slow, or scary, holes were always filled. I've never not made ends meet even whenever, like really early in business. So I have the experience of trusting the process a little more than David does, who ended up taking the role whenever a lot of those holes had been filled by me. So I have more practice at not stressing, I think than even David does. And I think part of that comes from just being in it and doing it. And at this point, having enough revenue streams that if something does have a slow time, I have other things that are doing

Kathleen Shannon 42:54
that are doing good. I definitely freak out about money. But here's why. I think that there is something about my personality where I believe if I don't have a sense of urgency or stress or worry around what I'm creating that it's somehow going to fail.

Unknown Speaker 43:14

Kathleen Shannon 43:15
Yeah, I probably need to go talk to, as I say, I think you need to talk that talk to a therapist about you know what's interesting right now I'm reading Dan Harris's book 10% happier. And it's so fascinating, because he worked in like a really high stress job situation where he's creating journalism stories on the news, every single day, he had meltdowns on air, he became a drug addict. Like we're just producing one podcast a week, and it's not even live. So I was reading his book, and he was talking about that same kind of sense of urgency and stress and worry around his job and kind of tying ambition, like tying ambition and stress together. And I think that I have kind of carved out that neural pathway in my brain where ambition and stress are very, very related, quite closely related. So I don't know maybe I need some drugs, not cocaine drugs, but like some some Lexapro or so right, and

Emily Thompson 44:20
what this,

Unknown Speaker 44:21
how does

Emily Thompson 44:21
anxiety manifest in your body?

Unknown Speaker 44:26
I mean,

Kathleen Shannon 44:30
I mean, I'm pretty Mind Body aware, I definitely have had stomach problems for a long time, especially as a teenager, I would like be nauseous all the time. But I've gotten pretty good at being aware enough of my emotions and letting them work out through my body and also by literally sweating it out. I mean, this is why I work out every single day to kind of manage some of that. I think that if I wasn't aware of my mind body connection and how my emotion were showing up even in my head, they would show up in my body a little bit more prevalent. We like as illness or sickness or disease. Like sometimes I really do worry. If I keep stressing like this, I'm going to give myself cancer, which then just gives me another thing to stress out about then I'm stressed about stressing This is a story of my life.

Emily Thompson 45:20
I don't mean to laugh at you.

Kathleen Shannon 45:22
No, I love that you're laughing at me. This is why this is why everyone you need a business. bestie. Right.

Emily Thompson 45:29
Because that's an intense Yeah, I think I do like the idea of you going to talk to a therapist about this, somebody won't laugh at you. At least not to your face.

Kathleen Shannon 45:39
And you know, that is something I have talked to people about anxiety and managing that stuff. But I think it's a part of my personality that is just going to be a part of who I am. And I just have to learn how to manage and cope with it. I'm aware of it. I wish I could change how I am. But what if I changed how I was and we didn't have a podcast? Snap? Anyway, let's move on.

Emily Thompson 46:07
Done with that one?

Unknown Speaker 46:09

Emily Thompson 46:10
what do we talk, we talk about money. So you stressed about money. I want to talk about how you make it because I brought some up something that I want to dive deeper into. And this is like multiple streams of revenue. And even I don't know, like how to build that and what that looks like and why you would want to do that. Because I think this is a this is an important boss topic, where having having more than one stream of revenue is how you build security on a whole other level, please.

Kathleen Shannon 46:39
Yeah, and we did that entire money episode recently, Episode Number 103, where we talk a lot about pricing and money management. But I will talk a little bit about how I make money and how I kind of think more entrepreneurially and full philosophically about money. But um, I make money at braid creative. And I've definitely shifted my focus on to being boss. And I've been putting a lot of attention on that. And that has raised a lot of questions between me and my sister about do I stay in braid? Do I leave, I'm like that I created it. And I still love it. And I'm still super proud of it. And even though I shifted my attention to being boss, and now that's making money, I don't want to It's okay, here's what's different about working a day job versus being an entrepreneur is working a day job, you go from one job to the next. And I was kind of tempted to follow that model. Like what if I just went from braid to being boss, except that I started braid creative, I started being boss with you. And I don't think that there's any reason that it has to be either or I think it can be both. And I also would a lot of people don't know is I have a investment property company called ampersand properties that I own with my husband. And together, we own eight houses, we rent out seven of them. We've paused on that for a minute to save up our cash to hopefully move. So like we are taking actual steps for that. But that's kind of more of like a long term investment retirement plan. But so I really have those three streams of revenue. And then really long term, there's stuff like 401 Ks. Anyway, so like that, those are all the ways that I make money, and I, I'm really comfortable with those three streams. And within those three streams, we have things like one on one services, digital product, we've got our being boss club house. But for the most part, whenever I think about those three buckets, I'm good with that. I don't need another business. I don't need to become like a serial entrepreneur. I would read this spread thin and fried. Right,

Emily Thompson 48:54
I love that. And I I do think I love this. Like, we should start talking to our guests about like, how many streams of revenue Do you have, um, just to, like, get an idea of what this looks like. Because as especially as we've grown our team and as I, I talked to friends. As we're all like growing up and getting jobs and making money and doing things I think there is some some some magic involved or some like hardcore life, money making strategy that comes into thinking about your your life as a business or your life as a model and how it is that you make money. I feel like I'll do often people will get a full time job and think, Okay, this is it. I have my one stream of revenue, and I have job security and all these things. And then you get fired or you get laid off or whatever. And then you're screwed. And I think that or even like entrepreneurs who have one service, and then whenever they don't book that one service, they're not making any money or whatever it is. I think there's so much to be said about that having multiple streams of revenue. I have been boss I went through the same thing whenever I I took my focus off of in the typography and put it on to being boss, like, do I let in the geography just die away? And I was like shit, no, like, I've spent six years building a brand. And sure we don't we change services, we don't offer one on one websites anymore. But we do you have the capacity to create, create digital products that can replace that. So having being boss, an indie show, biography, and David and I are, are always open to some other things we do feel like maybe we have some space for something. And when I say we, I mean mostly him in terms of something else that we can do to sort of business model our lives and make money in a way that is much more secure than that traditional belief that if you get a full time job, and have all your bills paid, then you're good for life, because I don't think that works anymore. So I love that multiple streams of revenue are where it is at.

Kathleen Shannon 50:57
I think that's also what stresses me out about money a little bit is that we hang out with a bunch of really wealthy entrepreneurs. And I don't feel like I'm quite there yet. And I would love to be there. I would love to be a millionaire, but keeping it real guys, I'm not a millionaire. So I think that there's something to be said to for just being a working creative. And I kind of miss those days of being happy to just pay my bills. Like why do I need a way, the same kind of stuff that I need to like, work through and maybe not on our podcast?

Emily Thompson 51:30
Right? Same things I was I was really pissed whenever I turned 30 and not because I turned 30 cuz I'm totally cool with that when I turned 30 and I had never been put on a 30 under 30 list. Like That was my thing was like shit, I wasted 30 years of my life. So I agree. I have a couple of those. Those internal wars shoot for 40 under

Unknown Speaker 51:56

Emily Thompson 51:56
Good I'm down for that. We got 10 years. Let's go.

Kathleen Shannon 51:59
And maybe we can do like a Forbes 40 under 40 list.

Emily Thompson 52:03
Let's do it. You go.

Unknown Speaker 52:06
All right,

Kathleen Shannon 52:07
I want to do before we close out this episode a couple of quickfire questions. Yes.

What's your favorite food?

Unknown Speaker 52:15

Unknown Speaker 52:17

Unknown Speaker 52:20
Yay, carbs. Yay, carbs. What's your favorite movie?

Emily Thompson 52:24
Probably not a surprise after what I told you earlier. Miss Congeniality is my favorite movie. Or maybe like any of the Lord of the Rings like a plus the hobbit like those I could watch over and over it takes like a month to do it. But maybe those What about you? Oh.

Kathleen Shannon 52:43
I think Darjeeling Limited. Or Kill Bill. volumes one and two.

Emily Thompson 52:48
Oh god, you're that person. I just learned more about you than I need.

Kathleen Shannon 52:53
Really? You don't like Kill Bill.

Emily Thompson 52:55
I hated Kill Bill.

Kathleen Shannon 52:57
Yeah, we can't be friends. Okay, what's your favorite book?

Emily Thompson 53:03
Oh, shit. Harry Potter's and all like I had to pick one number three.

Kathleen Shannon 53:09
Hmm, I haven't read them.

Emily Thompson 53:12
I know. You're right. We can't be friends. Big Boss into your guys. What about you?

Kathleen Shannon 53:22
Okay, you know, a book really just has stuck with me for years. I read Stephen King's the long walk. And I don't know that it's my favorite book. But it changed me. And I don't know how they it really impacted me. It's a really short book if you guys want to read it. The Long Walk. Okay. What is your biggest fear?

Unknown Speaker 53:43

Unknown Speaker 53:46
Yeah, pretty sure.

Kathleen Shannon 53:50
Mine is dying and leaving my child motherless and or my child's dying and leaving me childless. Not just childless. But without Fox. Love that kid. Oh, I don't want to die and I want him to die. That's shit. Well, yeah, I mean,

Emily Thompson 54:09
I mean, half of

Kathleen Shannon 54:13
the therapist over here. Okay, what is your biggest dream or goal like wildly improbable goal.

Emily Thompson 54:22
Dream World Peace. Shit. I'm a total pageant girl on a budget world peace. But goal is that being boss contributes to that hugely. Right?

Unknown Speaker 54:38
I want to talk show.

Emily Thompson 54:40
There you go. Oh, so Okay, that also, I really want to be the next Martha Stewart. Minus maybe gel. No, definitely minus gel time. But I also really want a talk show with Snoop Dogg or a Snoop Dogg like character.

Kathleen Shannon 54:56
You know that jail that she went to is pretty Cush. I would know him. Hanging out there for a couple of years.

Emily Thompson 55:02
And well, I mean, most of it was actually like house arrest, which also especially if you're Martha Stewart is not going to be dull by any means. You're gonna have plenty of crafts to do.

Kathleen Shannon 55:16
Yeah. All right. Well, I hope that you guys have gotten to know us a little bit better today.

Emily Thompson 55:21
For better or worse. This is who we are. So hopefully you can take even more understanding to all this shit we say in our podcast. Enjoy. World Peace.

Kathleen Shannon 55:36
Alright, you guys, I live and die by my Google Calendar. If an event date or meeting doesn't make it into my calendar, it is definitely not happening. But I noticed over the past year my calendar has been filled to the brim with meetings, there was no space to actually do the work. Even when I would block off time for myself, I would inevitably fill that space with another meeting, I was having a really hard time sticking to my boundaries. And that's when I finally set up acuity scheduling to help me hold myself accountable to my own rules. When someone wants to book a meeting or a coffee date with me, I simply send them my availability with a lead to my acuity calendar. They book an appointment when I make myself available and that is that acuity helps me keep my own appointments with myself just as important as those with other people. Sign up for a free 60 day trial of scheduling sanity at acuity scheduling calm slash being boss. Thank you for listening to being boss. Find Articles show notes and downloads at WWW dot being boss club.

Emily Thompson 56:44
If you're a creative entrepreneur, Freelancer or small business owner who is ready to take your goals to the next level, check out the being boss clubhouse, a two day online retreat followed by a year of community support, monthly masterclasses book club secret episodes and optional in person retreats. Find more at www dot being boss club slash clubhouse.

Kathleen Shannon 57:08
Thank you so much to our team and sponsors who make being boss possible our sound engineer and web developer Corey winter. Our editorial director and content manager Caitlin brain, our community manager and social media director Sharon lukey. Our graphic designer Jessica Bramlett and our bean counter David Austin, with support from braid creative and indicia biography.

Emily Thompson 57:28
Do the work. Be boss, and we'll see you next week.