Podcast Trends for 2022 with JJ Ramberg

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[00:00:37] Emily Thompson: Welcome to Being Boss, a podcast for creatives, business owners and entrepreneurs who want to take control of their work and live life on their own terms. I'm your host, Emily Thompson. And in this episode, I'm chatting about what's happening in the world of podcasting, both as a listener and a creator with JJ Ramberg co-founder of GoodPods.

[00:00:57] You can find all the tools, books, and links. We referenced on the show notes at www.beingboss.club. And if you liked this episode, be sure to subscribe to the show and share us with a friend.

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[00:02:01] JJ Ramberg is the co-founder of GoodPods, the podcast player, where you can follow your friends, groups, and influencers to see what they're listening to. She's also the co-founder of dogdog.org the search engine that donates profits to dog shelters. She was recently listed as one of Inc magazine's female founders, 100 and GoodPods was honored as one of fast company's most innovative companies.

[00:02:25] JJ was an anchor on MSNBC for over a decade.

[00:02:30] JJ, welcome to Being Boss. I am so glad to have you here.

[00:02:33] JJ Ramberg: And I thank you, Emily, for inviting me to talk to you. I appreciate it.

[00:02:37] Emily Thompson: Of course. I mean, everyone listening to this as a podcast listener, obviously I think everyone is really interested in what's happening in podcasts.

[00:02:45] Everyone has a bit of an invested interest in it. So I'm excited to dive in, into what's happening into this like wild medium that has just blown up over the past couple of years.

[00:02:57] JJ Ramberg: I know it's been amazing to see how the whole industry has grown. Right. And people who I knew a few years ago who were like, oh no, I don't listen to podcasts now are obsessed with them.

[00:03:08] Emily Thompson: Yeah, for sure. For sure. Perfect. So then let's dive in. I'd like to start with just an introduction of yourself. Who are you? Who, what do you do and really more importantly, tell us about the journey. How did you get to where you are today?

[00:03:21] JJ Ramberg: Sure. So I am the founder co-founder of GoodPods, which is a podcast app where you can play podcasts and search for them, et cetera, like you can do on any other podcast app.

[00:03:33] But the magic of GoodPods is that we feel like we've really solved the discovery problem. On GoodPods, you can follow your friends and your favorite pod-casters and experts and groups to see what they're listening to. And we started it. Well, we started for a few reasons, but one of them was

[00:03:52] listeners side. I loved podcasts, but this was a few years ago. And I just found that I kept going back to the same ones because I was overwhelmed by all the choices out there. And I knew there are other things to listen to, but I just didn't know what they were. And I was like, oh, if I could only see what my husband or my best friend, you know, someone was listening to.

[00:04:13] And so that's what, what created, like, if you kind of picture Instagram, but just for podcast.

[00:04:18] Emily Thompson: Yeah, no, I love the platform. I think all of the listeners mostly know that I'm not a podcast listener. I don't do it a lot, but y'all, if I'm listening to podcasts these days and listening to it on GoodPods and mostly so that I can see what, like I follow my team.

[00:04:32] What does my team listening to? I follow other bosses. Such a handy tool. But how did you get there? How did you get to building a podcast platform that solves the discoverability issue like that is, that's such an interesting niche product. I'd love for you to share, like how, how you found yourself in that place.

[00:04:52] JJ Ramberg: So when we came up with the idea, I was an anchor, at MSNBC news, and which I had done for over a decade. And I have another company also that I'd started with my brother. So I was already an entrepreneur. And at the time I had a podcast with NBC. Which did well, but I knew it was also because I had NBC news behind me.

[00:05:12] Right. And I just felt like, okay, here we go again, where it's going to be the same voices bubbling up to the top who have these industry connections or deep marketing pockets or whatever it is. And so I really, I came at this from two sides, one from the listener side, but also from the podcaster. And how do we elevate other voices?

[00:05:33] Because there are all these amazing people who you want to listen to. You just never heard of them. And so my brother and I were just talking about this idea and since we had already worked together, and already had started a company together and for my brother is actually his third company. We just decided let's go ahead and launch it and see if it works.

[00:05:52] And so now we loved it and it's working. So it's been really, really fun to just watch this company grow. [00:06:00]

[00:06:00] Emily Thompson: Yeah, I love that you're even talking about, you know, getting into this discoverability solution from the side of you were already sort of easily discoverable, more or less like, you know, you had a network behind you.

[00:06:15] And so it wasn't from a place of like, people can't find me. It was more of from a place. People can't find other people, right? Like how do I almost sort of even the playing ground, or really elevate voices that don't have those deep pockets behind them to be, to be found. So what was it like, I guess what was some of those early days?

[00:06:39] Like what, how did you, how did you begin the process?

[00:06:44] JJ Ramberg: Well, well, what's interesting now to Emily's in those days, right? If you had deep pockets, you could get discovered, but now there are so many podcasts that we get, you know, we get called by people who you would think have no problem getting discovered, right?

[00:06:58] Who also call us and say, wait, how can we be more involved with you all? Because even though I'm well-known someplace else, I'm having trouble getting people, listening to my podcasts. But the early days, so the early, early days when we came up with the idea, I went and I talked to, I'm not kidding. I know this sounds ridiculous, but it is true 700 people either in person over coffee, on the phone, on zoom, you know, on email 700 people to say, this is what I think the problem is.

[00:07:29] This is how I think we can solve it. Do you agree with me? And this was everyone from, you know, like obsessive podcast listeners to people who listen once a month to the heads of the biggest podcast production companies to podcasts success. I mean everyone. And so then I just took all that information.

[00:07:49] Right. And then we used it to create GoodPods.

[00:07:51] Emily Thompson: Yeah. Because the discoverability issue is real and you're right. It's not even just, you know, very top level. Everybody, everybody is having problems. And in particular on apple podcasts like that one, I think is one of the worst, but also one of the things I did a couple of several months ago, maybe almost a year ago now, as they went through and I downloaded almost all of the podcast apps that are, you know, easily accessible on the apple app store.

[00:08:20] And I just searched Being Boss the name of my podcast. And there were some of them where I didn't even come up when I was searching my own name. Like that should not happen. So there is this real issue within the environment of podcast apps. And even in some of the best ones that if you are searching for something, you are likely not actually getting the best results for what it is that you are looking for.

[00:08:51] So I love that. I love that you all have, you know, really gone with that at the forefront, because then it really is for podcasters, not just listeners, what really it is for listeners. I mean, they need to find what they're looking for. But it really is this sort of holistic view and it makes sense. It just makes sense.

[00:09:11] And then I also love that you guys have added this, this community aspect to it, right? It's not just really great search functions it's that you are able to discover so many other shows based on the things that your friends are listening to.

[00:09:28] JJ Ramberg: Well, it's still fun for me, right? I mean, anyone who's a podcast listener has this experience where you're about to go for a run or get in your car and you're like, what should I listen to?

[00:09:37] Right. And then you're like scrolling through, I don't know, finding top 10 lists somewhere, or calling a friend or texting someone or knit all over Twitter. You see what podcasts are you listening to? And so now what's so fun is when that happens to me, I come on to GoodPods. I go to my feed. And I see what my friends are listening to.

[00:09:56] And as a result, I've discovered so many cool shows and it's by episode for the most part too. So it's like, I don't someone doesn't say to me, Listen to my climate journey. They're like, here's the episode that I listened to that I love. I just said that because I just discovered this one yesterday. I saw a friend of mine listen to it.

[00:10:16] And it was an awesome episode. And I learned so much from, I would have never known about that podcast. I wouldn't even have come up probably in our conversation.

[00:10:25] Emily Thompson: Right. And, and so I really even want to lead into the next part of the conversation of like, of this is hopefully the future of podcasting, this place where discoverability is easier sharing is easier because the library of podcasts has become immense.

[00:10:44] It is massive and awaiting your way through all of the options and not even just shows. But episodes of shows or whatever it may be. You're right. It's completely overwhelming. And so this, this makes it easier and more fun, and you're able to connect with people along the way and get really great recommendations, which are absolutely love way better than what was happening in podcasting even three years ago.

[00:11:08] JJ Ramberg: Yeah, I love my husband wakes up earlier than I do and often listens to something. Right. And so I love being able to wake up and by the way, you can make anything you want private. Let me just put that out there. Indeed. I love waking up and seeing what you listen to. And then like, when I go for my run, I'll often go listen to this same thing because it's fun.

[00:11:28] And then we get to go talk about what we discovered or learned or laughed about from the show.

[00:11:33] Emily Thompson: Yeah. Oh, I love it. Okay. So. Through building GoodPods. You have put your finger on the pulse of podcasting. Right. And in a way that I think is probably a little more holistic than a lot of other platforms, right?

[00:11:45] You've like you've solved some problems. You've made it a little more, a little more friendly to use for everyone. And so I'm wondering. I want to move into this idea of like, what is happening right now in podcasting. So bird's eye view. What do you think are the common themes that are, that are coming up just generally in the world of podcasting these days?

[00:12:09] JJ Ramberg: Well, over the past year, really production value has gone way up for a lot of us. Right. I think, and also barriers to entry, which were already relatively low, had gone even further down. And so. So a lot of people are coming into the space and the space is becoming more mature. And so there are things happening around advertising and distribution, et cetera, where it's becoming a little less like the wild west and people are trying to solve all kinds of problems.

[00:12:39] So again, we're solving this community communication discovery problem, but there are other companies out there trying to solve some of the technical problems and some, and so. I think that the industry is just growing up. So. Yeah.

[00:12:54] Emily Thompson: Oh, I agree. I love this idea of it, of it maturing because you're right. I think it has the, the barrier to entry is lower, right?

[00:13:01] You, it, anyone and everyone can start a podcast these days and they are, and I love that. But at the same time, Those who are investing in it are really investing a lot into it. Like the amount of money I see going into producing a single show, or that advertisers are pumping into their, you know, their, their podcast strategies, or whatever it may be is becoming a little mind blowing considering where we were just a couple of years ago.

[00:13:31] JJ Ramberg: But I also think so, yes, there there's that with all these big companies spending tons of money, right. And treating it like, like you treat a TV show or something, but I also think that people are realizing the power of, of podcasts for, for small niche groups. So for example, I've been listening to this one called planet of the climates, which is about a particular web three organization called claim a doubt.

[00:13:55] And that podcast is for people who are interested and involved in this particular organization. And it's just a great way. It's almost like a newsletter, right? It's just, people are understanding that this is a great way to communicate information even to small group.

[00:14:13] Emily Thompson: Right. Right. So it's not even necessarily about creating a podcast that lots of people are going to listen to so much as like really communicating the thing to the couple of people.

[00:14:21] In some instances that are interested in what you do, which also I think is just a, it's a sign of maturation, right? We don't all need to serve everyone, but, podcasting has become popular enough that you really can niche down incredibly sort of granularly.

[00:14:37] JJ Ramberg: Yeah. That's why they're so fun. I always say like, if I'm lemon grower, I can go find some amazing podcasts on lemon growers.

[00:14:44] It's probably not an enormous audience, but it's super valuable to me. I'm just looking outside of my lemon tree by the way. Think of it.

[00:14:52] Emily Thompson: I love it. Right. And you're right. It has been. Been really amazing to watch, to watch podcasting grow in this way that now we are able to, really find a podcast about, just about anything, which is wonderful.

[00:15:09] And so it really does even make a place for anyone to. So if anyone is thinking of starting a podcast and you're wondering if what you want to talk about is too specialized, too niche. Not, you can totally do it.

[00:15:22] JJ Ramberg: It's not, but that's where GoodPods comes in. Right. Because then you have to find your audience.

[00:15:25] Absolutely. You gotta find your people and that's, that's what we're trying to do.

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[00:17:07] Emily Thompson: Perfect. And let's look at maybe let's look at 2022, like looking ahead into the future. If you see, like, what podcasting has been doing is maturing, right.

[00:17:18] Becoming more accessible for everyone, whether it's listeners or, or creators. But at the same time, maturing in ways where it's growing and problems are being solved and money's being pumped into it. And all of these things, where do you see things happening in 2022? And I. Start with consumer. So if, if you're talking to listeners, what should they expect happening in the next year?

[00:17:46] JJ Ramberg: From the listener side? More of the same, right. Just more great podcasts out there for you to listen to. And then. You know, again, I just come back to GoodPods, people solving the issue, then how do you choose and how do you discover things? Right. Cause that for the listener, that's the problem. The problem is just there's too much and you can't figure out where to get it.

[00:18:09] And so, so, you know, I can only speak for myself in that case. We're constantly adding new features and, and so just trying to make the app better and better.

[00:18:19] Emily Thompson: Yeah, I live at one of the things that I, one of the things that I keep hearing is, you know, the number of podcasts that a single person listen to fluctuates consistently, but I also feel like it's going to end up diversifying a lot in the next year.

[00:18:34] So to make that make sense, a couple of years ago, most people listened to four or five podcasts. Right. You subscribed to four or five, you listened to them pretty religiously. I think the pandemic hit and everyone's like podcast sort of pattern scattered, right? You weren't doing your commute anymore.

[00:18:52] So you stop listening to that one that you listened to every Tuesday or whatever it may be, and sort of things got shaken up. And we've had so much time at home that I've actually seen that number over the past year or so. I've heard it a couple of different ways, but, upping to where 5, 6, 7 podcasts is what most people is listening to.

[00:19:13] I'm blown away, but like, when are y'all finding time to listen to 5, 6, 7 podcasts? That is amazing to me. I think y'all have more hours in your day than I do. But that number is growing. I find that it's probably going to end up diversifying across more podcasts right over the next year. And that instead of listening to one super consistently, you're probably listening to twice as many shows, but really picking and choosing episodes.

[00:19:47] And I see this in terms of there's so many more podcasts out there now than there was even two years ago, that it's going to be hard to squeeze in everything unless you are being a little more choosy with episodes, and a little less choosy with shows.

[00:20:05] JJ Ramberg: Yeah. I mean, that's what, so that's my own behavior.

[00:20:09] Right? And that's, and, and also I find this is why I like seeing what my friends are listening to because there are things that I'm, I'm not going to listen to every, I listened to one yesterday. It was, today in Esoteric History. I think was the name of it. Right. So I'm not going to, I'm probably not going to listen to that every single day, but I saw one on a friend's feed.

[00:20:29] That was something totally interesting to me. And so I listened to it when I went for a walk. And, and so that's what I really like. I mean, what I love about podcasting is that you get to pop in and out of other worlds, like I want to learn about climate change or here's something funny or I to, you know, whatever it is, something of web three, like I get to pop in and out of these worlds, but

[00:20:55] I need a guide. I need, I need my friends telling me what to listen to. And then there are some that I listen to consistently, or that I subscribed to, but there are lots that I just I'm like, oh, that's a cool episode right now. I'm going to listen to that.

[00:21:08] Emily Thompson: Yeah, for sure. For sure. And so I see that being that being much more of a behavior of the listener.

[00:21:15] As we move through and into all of these shows being created. I also, I imagine that there being a really sort of drop-off of shows being continued.

[00:21:28] JJ Ramberg: Yeah. There are already a lot of people try. I mean, it's like anything, right? It's like, remember when blogging became a thing. And so many people are blogging then after a while you're like, yeah, this is not for me.

[00:21:38] Emily Thompson: Right. For sure. For sure. Okay. So that's the consumer side of podcasting. Let's look at the producing, like the creating side of podcasting. What sort of things do you see happening in the next year or so from the creator side?

[00:21:54] JJ Ramberg: Well, there's good technology. I mean, the technology is already much better to record and, and the hosting sites are making it much easier to distribute, et cetera.

[00:22:04] But I also think there's going to be a lot of interesting stuff happening in advertising. Yeah. And so, you know, making it easier for you to monetize your podcast if that's what you're interested in.

[00:22:14] Emily Thompson: Yeah, absolutely. I agree with all of that, those are the things that I'm seeing as well. And particularly around the tech, like even this morning, you know, Shure came out with their, their USB mic, a year ago now, two years ago now, Which was previously unheard of.

[00:22:32] Like, if you wanted to Shure quality mic, you had to have the whole setup, right? Mixer, a whole thing. You can not just plug that sucker into your, into your computer, but now like the nicest studio quality microphones are becoming more accessible for people who just want to plug it into their computer.

[00:22:52] And, and the SAS products as well that make it easy for you to host or edit or distribute or whatever are all becoming so much more easy and diversified. You can do so many cool things. Even here at the Being Boss team, we are doing, doing so many things with the podcast that we were not doing previously.

[00:23:12] And then I also want to touch base on the topic of transcripts, which is something that has been coming up more and more over the past year or two. And is something we actually talked about in an episode. Two weeks before this one, no one week before this episode goes live. I did an interview with Autumn Witt Boyd on what's happening in the legal world, for online businesses.

[00:23:36] And this idea of accessibility is a big one. And it's one that I've seen popping up in the podcasting world a lot where people are getting sued. For not having their podcast accessible to people who, who can not hear so not having transcriptions. So I do think that that is an additional sort of barrier to injury to be, you know, super compliant and accessible in the podcasting world over the next year.

[00:24:02] And I imagine there being more, more SAS tools. Right. More services and things offering are being offered around transcripts as it becomes more and more of industry standard operation for producing a podcast is you also have to make it accessible to those who aren't listening.

[00:24:22] JJ Ramberg: Yeah. I mean, I think this again is all part of an industry growing up.

[00:24:25] It's like, I mean, think of the industry as a startup, right? In the beginning, you launch something, you were just sort of like chasing your tail or, you know, working as hard as you can just to get this going, right. And then you get some processes in place and you get a little bit more money and now suddenly you can start filling in the holes.

[00:24:45] And so I think this is just what's happening with podcasting.

[00:24:49] Emily Thompson: Yeah, for sure. Also probably more celebrities.

[00:24:53] JJ Ramberg: Yeah, well, definitely.

[00:24:56] Emily Thompson: Way more celebrities.

[00:24:58] And I also imagine like more larger productions happening, in the next year. I think so much, so many other podcasts are showing the value that podcasting offers and that value is just growing and growing that I imagine that.

[00:25:14] More production is going to be going into some larger shows and networks and things like that over the next couple of years as well. It's really going to like put on this big girl pants.

[00:25:24] JJ Ramberg: It is, but then I don't want to take away from, again, all of the, kind of, you know, the creators, the indie podcasters, who out there putting great stuff together that may not have these huge budgets, but, but to a particular audience is still totally interesting.

[00:25:43] Emily Thompson: Absolutely. And what a, what a great sort of medium that allows for both.

[00:25:47] JJ Ramberg: Yeah. Yep. Yep. Yep. I agree.

[00:25:49] Emily Thompson: Right. And equal accessibility more or less, unless you're like behind Spotify paywall or any number of things, but really with pretty much equal accessibility in terms of having access to an audience.

[00:26:00] JJ Ramberg: Yeah, exactly, exactly.

[00:26:02] Like the one I listened to yesterday, but my climate journey, it was just an interview. I mean, I'm sure it didn't cost anything compared to, I don't know, wind of change, which I had listened to. Right. Which is a big production and super expensive, but they both serve a purpose for me to listen to.

[00:26:19] Emily Thompson: I love it.

[00:26:20] Okay, perfect. I do love podcasting. I love being in this industry. It's such a cool space to be. Okay. One of my favorite parts of these interviews that I've been doing is looking at sort of a comparison of what has been working, what is, or isn't working now and where things may be changing. So two questions, one is in the world of podcasting, either consumption, you know, as a tech company that supports or like hearing from creators, what do you believe has been working in the past that is not working now in terms of podcasting?

[00:26:56] JJ Ramberg: Again, I'll stick in my lane here, which is discovery. So in the past, We weren't bombarded with so much great content. Right? So it wasn't, it wasn't as hard to find stuff to listen to because there were not as many choices. Now, there are so many choices that the old means of discovery are not working.

[00:27:18] Well, I would say GoodPods is working, but that's right. That's what we're, that's what we're solving for.

[00:27:24] Emily Thompson: Yeah, no, I completely agree. There is so much out there that it is so hard to within, you know, the traditional platforms, especially, to get discovered. Discoverability is consistently something that we are working on and I will say the podcast platforms, but also I think Google, I think Google has a lot to, a lot to work on in terms of making audio, a more discoverable medium through the search functions, just in that space.

[00:27:57] JJ Ramberg: Yeah.

[00:27:57] And so, and so I just think, you know, as the universe of podcast continues to grow discoverability for the, for the consumer is just, is the problem that, that they need to solve.

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[00:29:04] Perfect. Then the next side of this question. Is there anything that hasn't worked in the past that you think is working now?

[00:29:12] JJ Ramberg: Oh, well, I, this is a little twist on the question, but I think it is just growing. There are many more people listening to podcasts. So it was just awareness of podcasts and how there's great audio content out there and how to find it.

[00:29:31] And right. So, so what's not working in the past is just the audience

[00:29:36] growth.

[00:29:37] Emily Thompson: Yeah. Like from this side of things, the thing that I want to add in here is advertising. And I feel like advertising has really started hitting its stride in terms of really brand expectations. So, you know, for years we've had, we've had conversations with brands and occasionally we'll have brands come in who will want to chat and they like, they are using the space for conversion.

[00:30:02] And let me tell you, what's not great for conversion. Being heard in a car, that's driving down the road,

[00:30:12] right? If someone is driving down the road or doing the dishes or on a run or whatever, they're not going to stop what they're doing. They're going to pull over on the side of the road. They're probably not going to dry off their hands and go to that link. Like, it's just not really going to happen. And for a long time, that was absolutely the expectation.

[00:30:28] Then I remember very early on, I'm having to do a lot of education with our sponsors of this is not a conversion platform. Like you are not going to convert this as a brand awareness platform. Everyone's going to hear your name. Over and over again. And that way, whenever it is time for them to find the solution that you have, you're going to be top of mind.

[00:30:48] And it took, I've had many conversations and had many advertisers turn around, many times because they were coming for conversion. But finally, I feel like over the past year or two, people who are advertising in the space or understanding that this is not a conversion platform, it's a place for brand awareness.

[00:31:12] And those conversations have become so much more easy and so much more engaging because they're not here to put an ad in a thing and just get some conversions out of it. They want to engage with your audience, right. They want to really invest in things. And this is, you know, More or less across the board.

[00:31:31] There has been this mindset shift in advertising in the podcast realm that I think is finally beginning to align with how this medium actually works for brands.

[00:31:42] JJ Ramberg: Right. It makes sense. I also think beyond that, there's also just a greater awareness for brands that podcasts are a great place to advertise.

[00:31:52] Emily Thompson: Yeah, for sure. For sure. I love it. And I also, I also really love that there has been such a community that has been built within the realm of podcasters. I think that's something there wasn't really one in the beginning. I remember when Kathleen and I started the show, it was like, we were the only people we knew who had a podcast.

[00:32:13] Right. We were it. And now there's like communities and events and newsletters and all of these things. It's, it's really great to see the sharing of information. And the community built out of this space too. It's there's so much working, I think, in the world of podcasting now. Wasn't even there to not work that in the past.

[00:32:35] JJ Ramberg: Exactly.

[00:32:36] Emily Thompson: I love it. Perfect. So, okay. And I guess there's one of wrap this up. I'm wondering if you have any, any words of advice for someone who may be thinking about getting into the podcasting game and podcasting game. Like maybe someone is just a light podcast listener and want to like really devote themselves to learning new things through podcasting, or through listening to podcasts, or maybe someone who's thinking about starting their podcast.

[00:33:01] What sort of words of advice do you have for anyone in that space? In the beginning of 2022.

[00:33:08] JJ Ramberg: Sure. So for someone who is wanting to start a podcast, I would say, think about it. Think about, do you have the time that you want to dedicate to this? Do you have something that you want to say that you feel like people want to listen to?

[00:33:22] And if the answer is yes to both of those things, then just do it, but do not expect it to take off right away. You know, and it, and it's gonna, it's going to, the production is only part of it. The getting the word out of it is the other part. And just know that going in that there are two sides to this and you're going to have to work equally hard at both of them.

[00:33:41] But, but there's no reason to not give it a shot. Right. If you have the time and you have the inclination, there's no reason to not give it a shot. For listeners who want to listen more again, I would say go use GoodPods as your player, because it is an easy way for you to discover by episode really cool things that your friends are listening to, or, you know, people who like what you like are listening to.

[00:34:06] And so it is, it will take away sort of the like paralyzing, overwhelmedness of how many podcasts there are out there.

[00:34:16] Emily Thompson: Yeah, for sure. Okay. Yes to the GoodPods again, guys, I use GoodPods. This is not sponsored either. I just love it. I've talked to JJ before I had to have her come and talk to talk with me about this.

[00:34:27] JJ Ramberg: I know, I apologize.

[00:34:28] I feel like I'm sounding like a commercial, but it's because we keep talking about discovery and I'm like, well, wait, we saw that problem.

[00:34:35] Emily Thompson: Right? You do. It's a really great platform. And I love it for that. And then I also, I want to go back to this, what you were saying about, about people who are looking to create podcasts, because I think if I were to add something to this as someone who's like watching the space from like, from like an academic standpoint, From a strategic standpoint, and someone who's in it is one of the things that I keep sort of seeing I'm including this in an upcoming issue of our Brewed newsletter.

[00:35:07] I think maybe the one that goes live with this episode where I've seen this more and more in, in the Being Boss podcast. And I also recently saw an analysis around this as well, is that half of new downloads for shows is your archives. In general, so like, if you are releasing new shows every single week, only half of your downloads every week are generally going to be for that new episode, meaning that your archives are staying warm.

[00:35:39] Forever. And that's something that is not happening on Instagram, right? Like once you post something it's gone and even in the world of blogging, that actually is probably a little more comparable because Google search will continue to index it. It's something that I am seeing paralleled in Pinterest as well, but in general, podcasting is a really great evergreen medium.

[00:36:04] And so you can create content that really does sort of live on for awhile. I even have friends, who have created a podcast, had a limited run of episodes, and those are still sending people, clients, right? They're still getting clients from their episodes. They're still getting downloads. They are still like if they're using a, an app that has good, discoverability right there is still being able to be found.

[00:36:28] And so there is this evergreen nature to podcast that makes me feel great because in most mediums that people are currently using evergreen, isn't an option, but with podcasts, it really is there. Our episodes are weekly downloads. Half of our downloads are from our entire archive of podcasts. They really do have some staying power, that I think should encourage people to use this medium.

[00:36:58] And along those lines, feel free to do short run at, seasons or maybe just ACS and maybe a show that has six episodes and you move on to the next project. I think that shows, gone at with that sort of purpose and intention have a lot of, a lot to give someone who is a creator.

[00:37:18] JJ Ramberg: You know, Emily, when we, I was telling you about those days when I talked to 700 people before we launched GoodPods, when we were still trying to think of what this was going to be and how people will share and listen, et cetera.

[00:37:29] One of the reasons at the time we didn't realize we were going to be a player. Now we're a players will also, you can play it. We thought we would just be a sharing mechanism. And one of the reasons we were really focused on sharing by episode, not just by show, could you can do either was because I spoke to

[00:37:47] this guy, a good friend of mine who is one of the top podcasters in the country. And he said to me, look, I have an archives of two years at the time of shows that I want to get in front of people again. And so like for someone to share an episode from a year ago on your platform is meaningful to me.

[00:38:06] Because then I get them back in because again, it's evergreen.

[00:38:09] Emily Thompson: Yeah. It's evergreen content that you spent a lot of time and energy creating a lot of it. And that's something that I think through the years of discoverability becoming better across most platforms, is really becoming reality. Right? These old episodes really do have really great staying power, and something that we experienced our first episode, our first episode, we recorded our first episode

[00:38:35] seven years ago. Eight years ago is still one of our highest downloaded episodes. Cause people will go all the way to the bottom, start there and continue through. And then there's also a couple of key episodes that are just really great for discoverability around the of great keywords, that are up there too.

[00:38:54] So it really is an interesting platform. I think a better use of time than most social platforms. Reading like a Keystone piece of content. So for creators who are thinking, you know, if it's worth it longterm, I think so. Even if you're not making a long-term commitment to producing a podcast.

[00:39:13] JJ Ramberg: Yeah.

[00:39:14] Emily Thompson: I love it. Perfect. I'm also wondering before we wrap this up. You sort of sparked this in me 700 people, 700 podcasters, one important piece was old episodes. Can you share any other sort of key things that you took from those 700 podcasters?

[00:39:31] JJ Ramberg: Yeah, it was 700 podcasters listeners, producers wasn't just podcast.

[00:39:35] It was everyone. I mean, look at all the key things that we learned, we put into the app, which is, you know, which is like, it's hard for me to know what to listen to what I'm going out for a run, because I, someone told me about something at a dinner party, but when it gets time to listen, I forget what it was.

[00:39:56] I wish there were a place I could find it or, you know, a creator saying, I want to be able to have a way to interact with my audience, because this is such an intimate, medium. And yet I want to be able to respond to them in some way. Right. Then we heard from indie podcasters saying we don't get on top 10 lists cause I can't compete with the daily.

[00:40:15] Right. And so we created indie podcast list and so yeah, more stuff like that.

[00:40:22] Emily Thompson: Perfect. Wonderful. Well, thank you so much, JJ, for coming and sharing this conversation with me, I will say everyone, go check out GoodPods come find me and follow me and you'll see the rare occasions in which I will listen to a podcast.

[00:40:37] See what I listening to spoiler. Sometimes I do listen to Being Boss.

[00:40:45] Right. Where can people find more about GoodPods and you around the internet?

[00:40:53] JJ Ramberg: You can go to GoodPods downloaded on the app store or the Google play store I'm on Twitter or Instagram, JJ Ramberg. Or, you know, if you want to reach out because we have an idea, you can email me jj@goodpods.

[00:41:07] Emily Thompson: JJ, what makes you feel most boss?

[00:41:12] JJ Ramberg: It is not sitting here talking to you and like running out there with a blanket over me. Cause it's so cold in my house.

[00:41:21] Emily Thompson: Okay, perfect. So not that.

[00:41:26] JJ Ramberg: What is the thing that makes me feel most boss working with my team, having created something that we see that people are using and they're excited about that's, that's what gets me

[00:41:37] excited. It's funny. I don't, I don't ever think like I'm a boss, but I just, I loved, I love working with other people and creating stuff that we think is helping the world.

[00:41:48] Emily Thompson: Well, I definitely think that that is part of the definition of what a boss is a hundred percent. Perfect. Thank you for sharing that with me and thank you for coming for this chat.

[00:41:57] JJ Ramberg: Thanks, Emily.[00:42:00]

[00:42:01] Emily Thompson: All right boss, because you're here. I know you want to be a better creative at business owner, which means I've got something for you. Each week the team at Being Boss is scouring the news that best entrepreneurial publications and updates and releases of the apps and tools that run our businesses and is curating it all into a weekly email that delivers the must know tips and tactics in the realms of mindset, money and productivity.

[00:42:24] This email is called Brewed. We brew it up for you each week to give you the insight you need to make decisions and move forward in your creative business. Check it out now and sign up for yourself at beingboss.club/brewed. That's beingboss.clubs/B R E W E D. Now, until next time, do the work, be boss.[00:43:00]